Some feedback on the 0.2.1 demo

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Auris
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Some feedback on the 0.2.1 demo

Postby Auris » Thu Dec 13, 2007 2:55 am

I think this game is moving at a fast pace and is getting better and better. Absolutely beautiful, highly innovative. and at the same time it feels like one of the totally awesome "old school" classics. The change to OpenAL is really noticeable, the music sounds a lot cleaner than before. All the new gimmics look beautiful - like the stamina bar or the transparent "entering map x graphic". Though I must say it could maybe turn out a bit annoying/distracting when you know your maps and don't need that information anymore.
I think most of the issues of 0.2.0 were gone except the "edgy obstacles" which still give an unpleasant gameplay. I didn't notice any performance or stability problems though I've desperately tried to break the game :D

Well still a few things i've noticed and did not like:

When I first started the game I got the "keything" popup, a good idea but:
It didn't ask me to redefine something and did not tell me how to exit it. Well first I tried the mouse (yeah stupid I forgot there is no mouse :heh: ) then I pressed a radom key (space) and I got to boot mode, luckyly I opened the keysettings menue and found one of the keys was redefined as "space" and pause was "undedined". "Restore defaults" fixed it for me.

The balance is way off - up to level 5 (I think) it was barely possible to survive the initial attack of a bigger group. Two or three levels later the party was invinsible because of a >90% missrate of the enemies but the party's "evade" stat said 'only' 10% so maybe this is a bug. Then I have the feeling that with the time the enemies become a lot thougher and were moving insanely fast on the meter and got multiple attacks while my characters got slower and slower with increasing level. Also in the entire game I did not have a single 'miss' attack with any of the characters with any of the weapons.

The UI is a bit complicated if you have to cast a spell for or after a battle or for any different reason you have to:
s + select skill + f + f + select character + f + f + select spell + f + select target + f and then 6x d to get out of the menu.
Wow this is insane for a daily "routine" work like healing someone after battle. The point of selecting (all vs. battle vs. field spells) can be eliminated at all because you pressed 'use' earlier and you can't use battle skills outside of battle anyway. But im sure there is a lot more potential for improvement here. A "get-out-of-the-menu-no-matter-where-you-are-key" comes to my mind.
If you win the battle you need also to press a lot of keys:
f (open stats screen)
f (start xp distribution)
(optional) f (fasten xp distribution)
f (open skills learned)
f (open items found)
f (start drunes distribution)
(optional) f (fasten distribution)
f (return to map)
That is too much again and lots of room at least for not showing everything that did not change.

The save option in the party-menu is I think better placed in the quit-menu.

Additional minor bugs:

The "pause mode" is very unclean:
-it resets selected menu options or anything you have in your "shopping cart"
-let's move monsters through walls
-monsters sometime attack even if it is your turn
-produces some graphical glitches (like dissappearing of your item sprites)
-needs some seconds before the game is unpaused (this didn't happen in 0.2.0)
Is there actually a benefit in having a pause mode, when open the menu in map mode does the same?

When you select "refresh" and choose Claudius as target there sometimes is a sword(cursor) on one of his spells, sometimes not :huh: . Makes up up to three cursors on the screen which is confusing and got me to heal the wrong person more than once.

When jumping in a long item list from the first to the last item (a lot) and then exiting (press d). And entering again (press f) the item sprites are gone. But the items are still usable. And after reopening the menu (press s) everything is back to normal.

And last but not least it is possible to escape the "final" boss because we can run now :devil:
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Jetryl
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Re: Some feedback on the 0.2.1 demo

Postby Jetryl » Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:16 am

Auris wrote:I think most of the issues of 0.2.0 were gone except the "edgy obstacles" which still give an unpleasant gameplay.


I think I know what you're talking about - where most jagged/diagonal edges stop you, instead of letting you slide along them. I'm meaning to fix this one sometime soon.
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ChopperDave
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Postby ChopperDave » Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:17 am

If you win the battle you need also to press a lot of keys:
f (open stats screen)
f (start xp distribution)
(optional) f (fasten xp distribution)
f (open skills learned)
f (open items found)
f (start drunes distribution)
(optional) f (fasten distribution)
f (return to map)
That is too much again and lots of room at least for not showing everything that did not change.


It may seem like a lot, but that's how ever RPG I've played has been. It first starts counting down the XP, which you can skip by pressing ok again, then it pops up skills learned, which you press ok to move past, then it does the item and money countdown. We can probably make it go faster (such as removing the skills learned stage if no one learned any), but the rest I don't think is going to change much.
kess
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Postby kess » Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:16 am

ChopperDave wrote:It may seem like a lot, but that's how ever RPG I've played has been. It first starts counting down the XP, which you can skip by pressing ok again, then it pops up skills learned, which you press ok to move past, then it does the item and money countdown. We can probably make it go faster (such as removing the skills learned stage if no one learned any), but the rest I don't think is going to change much.


I have not been able to test 0.2.1 myself yet (since I cannot build it on my laptop due to luabind; am patiently awaiting a deb package), but if I understand this correctly...

Why not display more info at the same time? (Which is done in quite a few rpg:s.) To save time and clicks/key presses.
Auris
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Location: Germany

Re: Some feedback on the 0.2.1 demo

Postby Auris » Thu Dec 13, 2007 4:05 pm

Jetryl wrote:I think I know what you're talking about - where most jagged/diagonal edges stop you, instead of letting you slide along them. I'm meaning to fix this one sometime soon.

Yes exactly! Looking foreward to see them vanish :approve:
ChopperDave wrote:It may seem like a lot, but that's how ever RPG I've played has been. It first starts counting down the XP, which you can skip by pressing ok again, then it pops up skills learned, which you press ok to move past, then it does the item and money countdown. We can probably make it go faster (such as removing the skills learned stage if no one learned any), but the rest I don't think is going to change much.

My memory was playing tricks on me here, I thought 1-2 clicks were normal because i've been playing mostly pc-rpgs lately. In the crpgs it seems really not uncommon to even have to accept every single item you have gained. Though I don't think it is a good way because it is also possible to have all items + money + xp (for each character) in one click without loosing information or getting overwhelmed with information, for example bahamut lagoon does it that way. And an additional second screen, if something major happens (like level-up/quest items found/skills learned).

kess wrote:I have not been able to test 0.2.1 myself yet (since I cannot build it on my laptop due to luabind; am patiently awaiting a deb package)

What exact problem? I myself could not clean install both lua and lua50. And my luabind package was compiled against 0.5.1. So to not build everything from scratch in a local directory, I installed the developement packages (with the *.a files) and changed the Makefile to include *.a instead of the -llua -llualib and -lluabind. Maybe that does the trick for you. I can't tell you what the .deb packages are called, because I use an rpm-based manager. Note that you might have to rebuild your luabind.a with the same gcc you want to compile your game with.
sharpe95
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Re: Some feedback on the 0.2.1 demo

Postby sharpe95 » Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:41 pm

Auris wrote:.
The balance is way off - up to level 5 (I think) it was barely possible to survive the initial attack of a bigger group. Two or three levels later the party was invinsible because of a >90% missrate of the enemies but the party's "evade" stat said 'only' 10% so maybe this is a bug. Then I have the feeling that with the time the enemies become a lot thougher and were moving insanely fast on the meter and got multiple attacks while my characters got slower and slower with increasing level. Also in the entire game I did not have a single 'miss' attack with any of the characters with any of the weapons.


So true, so true. At the beginning, I struggled to survive, hanging on with a few healing potions. After I got to above level 7-8, it became ridiculously easy, with an almost 100% miss ratio on the enemies' part. The hits that connected only dealt, at most, 5 damage to Claudius and 9 damage to Laila (and that was the last battle with the ambush). Speed is also something that's unbalanced. Enemies often got two or even three hits in before the characters did.

If you talk to Jonas again, the monsters will attack you again. Not sure if this is intentional, or doesn't really matter.

I didn't really mind pressing the F and D buttons so much. Great game though, and will improve greatly (especially if you fix the combat balance).
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qubodup
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Postby qubodup » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:13 pm

[img:480:297]http://nothingdoesntsuck.googlepages.com/al1.png[/img]

And yes, you shouldn't need to press 'f' to activate a sub-menu, instead when cursor is on 'equip' you should already be able to select the char you want to strip/dress.

PS: The screen is real and the tiles are strange because I played around with them.

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